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Voir aussi [[Mattias Desmet/2025.08.24/Sous-titres]] | |||
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|'''Louis Fouché: Hello everyone, hello ladies, gentlemen, I am delighted to be back with you for a new "Entretien mortel", these discussions that bring together academics, researchers, citizens, from all over, but also caregivers, people with disabilities to try to discuss once again the issues of death, suffering, agony, and our fragility, and then around related issues of freedom, autonomy, and collective interdependence and mutual aid. In a burning legislative context in France, as you know, the Falorni bill on active assistance in dying, assisted suicide, and euthanasia, was passed by MPs at the end of spring and is stirring up public opinion for a part of it and will come back before the Senate in September or October, so I have... launched theses "Entretiens mortels" so that citizens can reclaim this issue of death and revisit it again with fresh, contradictory points of view, people who are very much for it, very much against it, and various and varied insights. So today I'm really happy to host on the scene Mattias Desmet. Professor Mattias Desmet, you're social psychology professor in the University of Ghent in Belgium. And you've specialized in the understanding and the concept of mass formation and the idea of how the social dynamics influence the individual behavior and how they can kind of mass form together, forming a new identification, which is this group doing something which is more than what the individual could understand by himself. Could you introduce yourself for the people who don't know you in France?''' | |valign=top|'''Louis Fouché: Hello everyone, hello ladies, gentlemen, I am delighted to be back with you for a new "Entretien mortel", these discussions that bring together academics, researchers, citizens, from all over, but also caregivers, people with disabilities to try to discuss once again the issues of death, suffering, agony, and our fragility, and then around related issues of freedom, autonomy, and collective interdependence and mutual aid. In a burning legislative context in France, as you know, the Falorni bill on active assistance in dying, assisted suicide, and euthanasia, was passed by MPs at the end of spring and is stirring up public opinion for a part of it and will come back before the Senate in September or October, so I have... launched theses "Entretiens mortels" so that citizens can reclaim this issue of death and revisit it again with fresh, contradictory points of view, people who are very much for it, very much against it, and various and varied insights. So today I'm really happy to host on the scene Mattias Desmet. Professor Mattias Desmet, you're social psychology professor in the University of Ghent in Belgium. And you've specialized in the understanding and the concept of mass formation and the idea of how the social dynamics influence the individual behavior and how they can kind of mass form together, forming a new identification, which is this group doing something which is more than what the individual could understand by himself. Could you introduce yourself for the people who don't know you in France?''' | ||
'''Mattias Desmet :''' Thank you for having me on. I will. Yes, well, as you said, I'm a psychology professor. I have both a degree in clinical psychology and a master degree in statistics. So I started my academic career with investigating the quality of academic research. And then, as you know, of course, most academic research is false. There is this wonderful paper: " Why most published research findings are false ". And well, that's one thing. That's how I started my career. And then in 2020, the corona crisis started. And that's where I started to speak out in... in public space, because I noticed that the statistics... that were used to underpin the mainstream narrative on Corona that they were wrong. And from the first week of the crisis onward, I started to speak out. And after a while, after a few months, when it was clear actually to everybody who wanted to see it, that indeed the statistics had been dramatically wrong, I noticed that the story just continued, that the narrative continued, that the Corona measures, the mandates continued. And that was the moment where I decided to try to show people the psychological mechanism that worked. Which are the same as the mechanisms that lead to the emergence of totalitarian states, which are the same as the mechanisms that led to the emergence of the Soviet Union and Nazi Germany. Which I called a "Mass Formation". That means like, maybe in French it would call it le "conditionement des foules". I think that would maybe be the best translation. A mass formation is like, it's the kind of group formation that makes people completely blind or which makes people incapable of taking a critical distance of what the group believes in and which makes them willing to radically self-sacrifice and which makes them extremely intolerant for everyone who thinks differently. So that's the phenomenology of a mass formation. It's this strange group formation which leads to these very strange states where mothers start to report their children to the state, children start to report their parents to the state, which destroys the entire social fabric, which destroys all human bonds between individuals and which replaces... that human bond between individuals by one bond between each individual separately and the collective state system. This process has always existed, but it became stronger throughout the last two centuries and we've seen it at work in the corona crisis and we still see it at work now because that's a dramatic characteristic of a mass formation. Once a major mass formation happens, it almost always leads to a second and a third and a fourth mass formation. So, I explained that theory of mass formation on many occasions. I've been doing this the last years and I wrote this book, " The Psychology of Totalitarianism ". | '''Mattias Desmet :''' Thank you for having me on. I will. Yes, well, as you said, I'm a psychology professor. I have both a degree in clinical psychology and a master degree in statistics. So I started my academic career with investigating the quality of academic research. And then, as you know, of course, most academic research is false. There is this wonderful paper: " Why most published research findings are false ". And well, that's one thing. That's how I started my career. And then in 2020, the corona crisis started. And that's where I started to speak out in... in public space, because I noticed that the statistics... that were used to underpin the mainstream narrative on Corona that they were wrong. And from the first week of the crisis onward, I started to speak out. And after a while, after a few months, when it was clear actually to everybody who wanted to see it, that indeed the statistics had been dramatically wrong, I noticed that the story just continued, that the narrative continued, that the Corona measures, the mandates continued. And that was the moment where I decided to try to show people the psychological mechanism that worked. Which are the same as the mechanisms that lead to the emergence of totalitarian states, which are the same as the mechanisms that led to the emergence of the Soviet Union and Nazi Germany. Which I called a "Mass Formation". That means like, maybe in French it would call it le "conditionement des foules". I think that would maybe be the best translation. A mass formation is like, it's the kind of group formation that makes people completely blind or which makes people incapable of taking a critical distance of what the group believes in and which makes them willing to radically self-sacrifice and which makes them extremely intolerant for everyone who thinks differently. So that's the phenomenology of a mass formation. It's this strange group formation which leads to these very strange states where mothers start to report their children to the state, children start to report their parents to the state, which destroys the entire social fabric, which destroys all human bonds between individuals and which replaces... that human bond between individuals by one bond between each individual separately and the collective state system. This process has always existed, but it became stronger throughout the last two centuries and we've seen it at work in the corona crisis and we still see it at work now because that's a dramatic characteristic of a mass formation. Once a major mass formation happens, it almost always leads to a second and a third and a fourth mass formation. So, I explained that theory of mass formation on many occasions. I've been doing this the last years and I wrote this book, " The Psychology of Totalitarianism ". | ||